Busting the "Islam Myths"

[Kabir]

Murad bhai...I hear you. But the issue with such a claim is that it will make some feel like someone is stabbing them inside. Some people are so emotionally bound that they cannot accept the reality.

One more thing that I want to point out is the Bangladeshi media...it portrays the fighters as flawless. When we comment about foreign media (read CNN) and its biases, we fail to see our own media and its biases.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by muradnyc
Amra shudhu Pakistani der dosh dei..amader je dosh sheta amra dekhi na..

1971 e amader deshi muktijuddara o amader deshe onek rape korche.. mostly Muslim meyeder-kei.. still amra odher dosh dei na.. but Pakis.

Amar abbu shedin boltesilo..erokom onek gulo kahini about our so-called war-fighters. Rajakar der cheye orai beshi raping korche..almost in all parts of BD.

i personally know such stuff happened, and even though i wont admit in front of a Pakistani, truth is "our people" commited many crimes as well, and many support it by saying "they only raped/murdered those who were against independence". Horrible reasoning if there ever was one......

so i blame all war criminals, rajakars and misguided muktijodhhas (those who raped etc) alike

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by al Furqaan

however, the point is that the quran superceeds all else - it's the word's of God Himself, not the actions of some prophet (peace be upon them all) narrated through a chain ad infinitum. the quran is undoubtedly infallible. the hadith are not. this proven scripturally as God made no promise to protect the teachings of the prophet muhammad. had he done so, there would not be any sectarinanism within islam.

golden words......but that wont deter people from saying ahadith are as authentic as Quran ....

[uvaskaves]

Assalaa-mualykum,
For all the members here who are criticizing Sahih Hadiths as not being 100% accurate, I ask you a couple of simple questions:

First, have you read the entire Quran in a language that you understand?
Second, were you able to understand the meaning of all the verses and put the verses in their appropriate context without tafsir from the Hadiths?
And, finally have you read about the process used to separate the authentic Hadiths from the mistaken or fabricated ones? The Science of Hadith

Now to my point. Any book, including the Quran, can be misinterpreted by people (i.e. terrorists, different sects.) to suit their own benefit. This is why the Hadiths are so important. They put the verses of the Quran in their appropriate context. The only interpretation of the Quran that is 100% correct, is the Prophet's (PBUH) interpretation. Afterall, the Quran was revealed to the Prophet (PBUH).

For the people who still argue that Allah said that he will only protect the Quran and not the Hadiths, I have a simple response. The only way to protect the correct interpretation of the Quran, is to also protect the Hadiths.

Furthermore, in the Prophet's (PBUH) last message to mankind before he died, he said:
"I leave behind me two things, the Quran and my example, the Sunnah, and if you follow these you will never go astray."

May Allah forgive me if I have said anything that is incorrect. Allah knows best.

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by uvaskaves
The only interpretation of the Quran that is 100% correct, is the Prophet's (PBUH) interpretation. Afterall, the Quran was revealed to the Prophet (PBUH).

walaikum salaam wa rahmatullah,

agreed. i agree the prophet's "interpretation" is the correct, simply because it is NOT his interpretation, but because its divine revelation. prophets speak not of their will but of the Will of God.

however, i am questioning the veracity of the transmission of the prophet's interpration of the quran (which is 100% correct). hadiths vary from person to person, and from sect to sect.

For the people who still argue that Allah said that he will only protect the Quran and not the Hadiths, I have a simple response. The only way to protect the correct interpretation of the Quran, is to also protect the Hadiths.

i am of the belief that the basics of islam can be learned without any extras except for the quran. yes some crucial piece of information is needed for contextual purposes (e.g. what does "fight them wherever you find them" mean?). however, that is history and as such is very nearly authentic (especially when even anti-islamic sources say the same thing).

my ultimate doctrine is that accept the hadith which correspond to the spirit of the quran. therefore, hadiths which say "chop off a theif's hand" i can accept, but those that say "stone the adulterer to death" may or may not be true, and given 22:4 are probably fabricated hadiths.

[uvaskaves]

Brother al Furqaan,

Thank for your response. I was wondering though, what were your answers to my three initial questions.

Quote:
"however, i am questioning the veracity of the transmission of the prophet's interpration of the quran (which is 100% correct). hadiths vary from person to person, and from sect to sect."

Did you read about the arduous process islamic scholars have gone through to verify the authenticity of a Hadith. I doubt that historians are as critical about their sources, as islamic scholars were about the narrators and the chain of narration of a Hadith. Thus, questioning "the veracity of the transmission" of a Sahih Hadith, without proof, is a disrespect to the scholars who worked so hard to authenticate the Hadith. What do you mean by "hadiths vary from person to person, and from sect to sect." Please provide an example of such a Hadith? (Remember we are talking about Sahih Hadiths).

Quote:
"i am of the belief that the basics of islam can be learned without any extras except for the quran. yes some crucial piece of information is needed for contextual purposes (e.g. what does "fight them wherever you find them" mean?). however, that is history and as such is very nearly authentic (especially when even anti-islamic sources say the same thing)."

The correct way to perform Salat, one of the pillars of Islam, can not be learned without Hadiths. What basics of Islam are you referring to that do not require Hadiths? Also, what do you mean by "especially when even anti-islamic sources say same thing." Do you consider anti-islamic sources more reliable than islamic sources?

Quote:
"my ultimate doctrine is that accept the hadith which correspond to the spirit of the quran. therefore, hadiths which say "chop off a theif's hand" i can accept, but those that say "stone the adulterer to death" may or may not be true, and given 22:4 are probably fabricated hadiths."

Please, give me an example of a Sahih Hadith that contradicts the Quran. Islamic scholars have gone through an incredibly diligent process to authenticate Hadiths, and to simply say that some of these Hadiths (again referring to Sahih Hadiths) are fabricated, without providing proof or evidence from the Quran or other Hadiths, is a very weak argument.

[al Furqaan]

Did you read about the arduous process islamic scholars have gone through to verify the authenticity of a Hadith. I doubt that historians are as critical about their sources, as islamic scholars were about the narrators and the chain of narration of a Hadith. Thus, questioning "the veracity of the transmission" of a Sahih Hadith, without proof, is a disrespect to the scholars who worked so hard to authenticate the Hadith. What do you mean by "hadiths vary from person to person, and from sect to sect." Please provide an example of such a Hadith? (Remember we are talking about Sahih Hadiths).

well, i take "sahih" to mean authentic hadiths, for example sahih al bukhari.

now even, in this most authentic book, i have found some hadiths which simply do not conform to the spirit of the quran. for example, i think i found a hadith on torture (not sure). but i can do some more reasearch. so i cannot accept something just because it happens to fall into the sahih al bukhari (which is a large collection of nearly 10,000 hadiths).

even on the cover of my particular copy of the sahih al bukhari, it states,

All muslim scholars are agreed that sahih al bukhari is the most authentic and reliable book, after the book of Allah.

cover of sahih al bukhari vol. 6
translated by Dr Muhammad Muhsin Khan
Darussalam Publications
ISBN: 9960-717-31-3 (set)

the sahih itself, at least my copy, itself claims the quran's superiority over it and all other books.

The correct way to perform Salat, one of the pillars of Islam, can not be learned without Hadiths. What basics of Islam are you referring to that do not require Hadiths? Also, what do you mean by "especially when even anti-islamic sources say same thing." Do you consider anti-islamic sources more reliable than islamic sources?

yes, i realize this. however, these hadiths, even if fabricated, do not violate the spirit of the quran. they actually enforce it. hence i have no problems with following these hadiths which deal with salaat, or sawm, etc.

as far as the anti islamic sources, what i meant to say was that even without the authenticity of the tarikh al islam (history) we can know the general context of passages of the quran, because no disputes certain things. for example, i mentioned, that even those who hate islam agree that the muslims fled mecca for medina. all historians, be they secular or religious, agree to that - and the quran attests to it, so we know that happened even without the hadith telling us that it did.

Please, give me an example of a Sahih Hadith that contradicts the Quran. Islamic scholars have gone through an incredibly diligent process to authenticate Hadiths, and to simply say that some of these Hadiths (again referring to Sahih Hadiths) are fabricated, without providing proof or evidence from the Quran or other Hadiths, is a very weak argument.

a hadith which is inconsistent with the teachings of the quran cannot be correct. the quran can't say one thing and the hadith another. the quran instructs us as to what we can and cannot do. the authentic hadiths show us how to do it (or how not to do it).

for example, there is a hadith that Aisha (ra) said about the Prophet:

His character was the Quran

this hadith i can accept because it makes logical sense.

[PoorFan]

From Wiki - The Collection of Shahi-al-Bukhari
These prophetic traditions were collected by the Muslim scholar Muhammad ibn Ismail al-Bukhari (810-870) and published during his lifetime. He was a scholar from Bukhara, hence the name by which he is known. Al-Bukhari belonged to the Shafi'i School [1]. He traveled widely throughout the Abbasid empire for sixteen years, collecting those traditions he thought trustworthy. It is said that al-Bukhari collected over 300,000 hadith and transmitted only the 2,602 traditions that he believed to be Sahih [2] [3] [4]

It is said that before he placed a hadith in his collection, he would perform ghusl (full\greater ritual ablution) and prayed two Rakah (Islamic unit for form of prayer) Nafl (voluntary prayer) to ask God for guidance[citation needed].

It is said that notable hadith scholars including Ahmad Ibn Hanbal 855, Ibn Maīn 847, and Ibn Madīni 848 accepted the authenticity of his book. Therefore al-Bukhari finished his work around 846, and spent the last twenty-four years of his life visiting other cities and scholars, teaching the hadith he had collected. In every city that he visited, thousands of people would gather in the main mosque to listen to him recite traditions. Regarding Western academic doubts as to the actual date and authorship of the book that bears his name, Sunni say that notable hadith scholars of that time, such as Ahmad Ibn Hanbal (855 CE/241 AH), Ibn Maīn (847 CE/233 AH), and Ibn Madīni (848 CE/234 AH), all accepted the authenticity of his book [1] [2]. Thus, the collections inmediate fame makes arguments regarding its being changed after the authors death highly improbable.

During this long period of twenty-four years, Bukhari made minor changes to his book, in particular its chapter headings. Each version is named by its narrator. According to Ibn Hajar Asqalani in his book Nukat, the number of hadiths in all narrations (versions) is the same. The most famous one today is the version narrated by al-Firabri (d. 932 CE/320 AH), who is a trusted student of Bukhari. Khatib al-Baghdadi in his book History of Baghdad had quoted Firabri saying: "There were about seventy thousands people have heard Sahih Bukhari with me".

Firabri is not the only transmitter of Sahih Bukhari. There were many others that narrated that book to later generations, such as Ibrahim ibn Ma'qal (d. 907 CE/295 AH), Hammad ibn Shaker (d. 923 CE/311 AH), Mansur Burduzi (d. 931 CE/319 AH), and Husain Mahamili (d. 941 CE/330 AH). There are many books that noted differences between these versions; Fath al-Bari is the most famous among them.

From Wiki - The Collection of Shahi Muslim
Imam Muslim (Muslim ibn al-Hajjaj) was born in 202 AH in Persia (817/818CE) and died in 261AH (874/875CE). He traveled widely to gather his collection of ahadith (plural of hadith), including to Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Syria and Egypt. Out of 300,000 hadith which he evaluated, approximately 4,000 were extracted for inclusion into his collection based on stringent acceptance criteria. Each report in his collection was checked for compatibility with the Qur'an, and the veracity of the chain of reporters had to be painstakingly established. Sunni Muslims consider it the second most authentic hadith collection, after the Sahih Bukhari.

However it is important to realize that Imam Muslim never claimed to collect all authentic traditions. He tried to collect only traditions that all Muslims should agree on about accuracy. There are other scholars who worked as Muslim did and collected other authentic reports.

According to Munziri, there are a total of 2200 hadiths (with no repetition) in Sahih Muslim. This would bring the total of Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim to 3000 ahadith. According to most Hadith scholars, [1] there are 1400 authentic hadiths that are reported in other books (mainly the Six major Hadith collections).

Question 1 : When we talk about authenticity of 'Shahi Bukhari' are we talking about those hadith ( 2600+ ) that Imam Bukhari himself believed to be Shahi ( authentic )? or his entire hadith book, which contains more than 7000 hadith? Same question goes with hadith 'Shahi Muslim', as it said that Imam Muslim has extracted 4000 hadith out of 300,000, whereas hadith Muslim book contains more than 9000 of hadith.

So once again my question is, when we talking on 'Shai hadith', are we talking about each and every hadith of those Six book? or only those that Imam Bukhari, Imam Islam has ( was able to ) recognized as authentic?

Question 2 : Is there any way to know exactly which are those hadith that Imam Bukhari and Imam Islam ( was able to ) recognized as authentic?

Those who have knowledge please share.

[Kabir]

One more myth: "Praying five times a day, eating halal, and wearing Islamic traditional clothes = you're the perfect Muslim"

No, you're not. There are many more factors in it. I know a person who prayed five times a day, worked really hard, gave zakat, did everything he could to be a Muslim. His only weak point? Well...he used to molest his own children and grand children.

The biggest myth in Islam, I believe, is...if you pray five times a day, Allah will guide you in His path. Well, Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself. If Allah did, you wouldn't commit such sins. Allah revealed the Holy Quran for you to help and guide yourself.

[uvaskaves]

Originally Posted by Kabir
One more myth: "Praying five times a day, eating halal, and wearing Islamic traditional clothes = you're the perfect Muslim"

No, you're not. There are many more factors in it. I know a person who prayed five times a day, worked really hard, gave zakat, did everything he could to be a Muslim. His only weak point? Well...he used to molest his own children and grand children.

The biggest myth in Islam, I believe, is...if you pray five times a day, Allah will guide you in His path. Well, Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself. If Allah did, you wouldn't commit such sins. Allah revealed the Holy Quran for you to help and guide yourself.

What is the point of your post? It makes no sense to me, and it contradictory to the theme of this thread, which is to disprove myths in Islam by using proofs from the Quran. You try to disprove some myth you created, by providing us an example of a single person.

Praying five times a day, eating halal food, and wearing appropriate clothing are all important aspects in Islam. I can provide proof from the Quran, if you want me to. Does it make you a perfect Muslim? No. Because there is no such thing as a perfect Muslim, since human beings are not perfect. We all make mistakes and we all commit sins. This is one of the reasons we pray five times a day, to ask for forgiveness and guidance.

Regarding you comments about "Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself," please read the translation of Surah al-Fatiha, where we ask Allah to guide us to the straight path. It is only Allah that can guide us, not ourselves. Yes we have the choice whether or not we want that guidance, but it is only Allah who can provide that guidance. There are many verses throughout the Quran that state that one who Allah guides, no one can lead astray, and whom Allah lets go astray, no one can guide. If you would like me to provide the Surah and Verse number for proof, I will be more than happy to do so.

[BD-Shardul]

Originally posted by Kabir
One more myth: "Praying five times a day, eating halal, and wearing Islamic traditional clothes = you're the perfect Muslim"

Kabir bhai,

In the Sura Al Anqabut of Al Quran, Allah declared, "Innus Salata Tanha Anil Fahsha ei wal munkar"

which means "definitely prayer prevents you from indecent and evil deeds".

Now talking about a person who prays and at the same time commits indecent acts (be it openly or secretly), then it means: His prayers are not being accepted by Allah. If his prayer were accepted by Allah, then definitely it would have prevented him from indecent (fahsha) acts.

Now why our prayers don't get accepted by Allah? May be what we are eating are not halal. May be what we are earning are not halal. May we have no sincerelty at all when we pray. May be we don't care about the composure during prayer. May be we pray to show some other people. When we don't care about these factors, our prayer become lifeless. It no more remains spiritual.

And when I was in high school, once our religion education teacher said to a boy after observing his prayer, "আচ্ছা, তুমি কী নামাজের সুরা-কেরাত আগেই পড়ে রাখ? মসজিদে এসে কী খালি প্রাকটিস দাও নাকি?"। ত কবির ভাই বিস্বাস করেন, আজকে আমরা মুসলমানেরা যে নামায পড়ি, তা শুধু প্রাকটিস। দুঃখজনক, কিন্তু সত্যি।


And the biggest factor is the taqwa, the fear of Allah. If someone doean't have it, any ibadah means very little to Allah.

And the "fear of Allah" is great factor. This is the factor that turned the savage people of "Aiyyame Jahiliya" into golden people. If we look into our current society, we see that crime is going up. Well, we are making rules, increasing security forces, and campaiging to increase awareness. All proved to be futile. These are not able to uproot crime 100% becasue no matter how much tight security/police patrol you have, if people get the chance, people will commit crime. But if you can instill Taqwa, the fear of Allah in the heart of people, it will work like a magic. Becasue they will then think that, even if no one is looking that he is molesting his child/grand child, Allah is looking. His mighty army, the angels are looking. And in the day judgement he will have to stand infornt of Him. What will be the answer that day? And definitely Allah will present his angels, the surrounding where the sin was committed, and his won body parts as winess against the sinner. No escape.

The biggest myth in Islam, I believe, is...if you pray five times a day, Allah will guide you in His path. Well, Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself. If Allah did, you wouldn't commit such sins. Allah revealed the Holy Quran for you to help and guide yourself.

Uvaskaves bhai has explained it excellently. Click on my sig (1) and then follow the meaning of Surah Al Fatiha.

And if God doeasn't want anyone to be guided, no one can guide him. Even the uncle of our Messanger, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) died as a "disbeliever". How sad!!! And just try to imagine how shocking it was for the our prophet, since he himself was the prophet of Islam. But Allah then said our prophet through Quran that only Allah can guide people, people can't. Prophet's own uncle's death as a non-muslim is a lesson for us all.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by uvaskaves

Because there is no such thing as a perfect Muslim, since human beings are not perfect. We all make mistakes and we all commit sins. This is one of the reasons we pray five times a day, to ask for forgiveness and guidance.

you are confusing issues.

there is a difference between someone who errs once in a while and prays to Allah for forgiveness, and someone who prays and yet is a habitual drinker. The latter often thinks that it is ok to drink because "all humans sins". He also thinks its ok to "sin" regularly as long as one gets forgiveness through Salat.

As far as I know, someone who intentionally and continually sins with aim that Allah will forgive him later on, may not be so lucky, and Allah knows best......

This practise is very common in Gulf region where some people drink all night and then pray Fajr in masjid, their logic is that the fajr prayer will remove sins on partying all night, so life for them is one big business, sin as much as you can and then do Haj or pray for forgiveness...........

[Puck]

Originally Posted by Kabir
One more myth: "Praying five times a day, eating halal, and wearing Islamic traditional clothes = you're the perfect Muslim"

No, you're not. There are many more factors in it. I know a person who prayed five times a day, worked really hard, gave zakat, did everything he could to be a Muslim. His only weak point? Well...he used to molest his own children and grand children.

The biggest myth in Islam, I believe, is...if you pray five times a day, Allah will guide you in His path. Well, Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself. If Allah did, you wouldn't commit such sins. Allah revealed the Holy Quran for you to help and guide yourself.

at last a sensible observation. however, i fear that your wise interpretation of freewill would be misunderstood by the fanatic as it already appear to have. islam is the only religion within the abrahamic tradition that thinks of 'man' as an independent and intelligent being, capable of using 'his' faculties to understand reason and thus interpret the world. there really is nothing more to be said about this subject. doing good is its own reward. once man discovers this simple truth from the quran for himself, everything else ceases to be a valid point of debate. it is all crystal clear. like that song, 'i can see clearly now that the clouds have gone..'

[BD-Shardul]

Kabir bhai, I have found the verses that Allah revealed to our Porphet (PBUH) after the death of his beloved uncle Abu Talib:

“Verily! You [O Muhammad (Peace be upon him) ] guide not whom you like.” [28:56]

“It is not (proper) for the Prophet and those who believe to ask Allâh’s forgiveness for the Mushrikûn (polytheists, idolaters, pagans, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allâh) even though they be of kin, after it has become clear to them that they are the dwellers of the Fire (because they died in a state of disbelief).” [9:113]

[BD-Shardul]

Originally Posted by Puck
at last a sensible observation. however, i fear that your wise interpretation of freewill would be misunderstood by the fanatic as it already appear to have. islam is the only religion within the abrahamic tradition that thinks of 'man' as an independent and intelligent being, capable of using 'his' faculties to understand reason and thus interpret the world. there really is nothing more to be said about this subject. doing good is its own reward. once man discovers this simple truth from the quran for himself, everything else ceases to be a valid point of debate. it is all crystal clear. like that song, 'i can see clearly now that the clouds have gone..'

Sometimes I feel that I will never ever come to BC, but I come again.

[Kabir]

Shardul...why take it so seriously man? Relax bro. End of the day, no one means any harm here...and no one is singling you out either.

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by uvaskaves
What is the point of your post? It makes no sense to me, and it contradictory to the theme of this thread, which is to disprove myths in Islam by using proofs from the Quran. You try to disprove some myth you created, by providing us an example of a single person.

Praying five times a day, eating halal food, and wearing appropriate clothing are all important aspects in Islam. I can provide proof from the Quran, if you want me to. Does it make you a perfect Muslim? No. Because there is no such thing as a perfect Muslim, since human beings are not perfect. We all make mistakes and we all commit sins. This is one of the reasons we pray five times a day, to ask for forgiveness and guidance.

Regarding you comments about "Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself," please read the translation of Surah al-Fatiha, where we ask Allah to guide us to the straight path. It is only Allah that can guide us, not ourselves. Yes we have the choice whether or not we want that guidance, but it is only Allah who can provide that guidance. There are many verses throughout the Quran that state that one who Allah guides, no one can lead astray, and whom Allah lets go astray, no one can guide. If you would like me to provide the Surah and Verse number for proof, I will be more than happy to do so.

kabir wasn't trying to attack anyone here. he was just trying to say that even if one observes the fard in islam of salaat, sawm, zakat, and hajj, if they do not behave as a "decent" human being, then they haven't learned anything about islam.

being a good person is also a fard, and without it, quality of imaan must be questioned.

as an example, during our liberation war, we were targetted by people believing themselves to be superior muslims for flimsy reasons. truth is, they were NOT superior muslims but we may have been inferior muslims. our culture has many questionable vestiges from the pre-islamic jahiliya which we as a community should abstain from as much as possible. examples include but are not limited to celebrations of pahela boishak, et al.

[Kabir]

Didn't quite get the time to compose this msg earlier today. But I didn't forget the comments made by uvaskaves and Shardul. So here it goes.

1. You can show me all the Surah's that you want. But unless you get the point I'm trying to make, you'll never be able to make your point.

2. Read my post carefully. What I meant to say is, Allah has given us the guidelines. And Allah has given us the BRAIN. If you don't understand what differentiates a human being from another animal, you must read books like "The Future of Human Nature". Every human being is a new beginning...and hence, new way to look at things.

3. Allah gave us brain to think...not to hide it inside our pants. Isn't it stated in the Quran that look for clarification in the Quran, and then to the Hadith, and then your own rational. For each one of these, I don't see how you cannot help but guide YOURSELF.

I'll continue this post tomorrow morning. Gotta go now...

[uvaskaves]

Originally Posted by Kabir
Didn't quite get the time to compose this msg earlier today. But I didn't forget the comments made by uvaskaves and Shardul. So here it goes.

1. You can show me all the Surah's that you want. But unless you get the point I'm trying to make, you'll never be able to make your point.

2. Read my post carefully. What I meant to say is, Allah has given us the guidelines. And Allah has given us the BRAIN. If you don't understand what differentiates a human being from another animal, you must read books like "The Future of Human Nature". Every human being is a new beginning...and hence, new way to look at things.

3. Allah gave us brain to think...not to hide it inside our pants. Isn't it stated in the Quran that look for clarification in the Quran, and then to the Hadith, and then your own rational. For each one of these, I don't see how you cannot help but guide YOURSELF.

I'll continue this post tomorrow morning. Gotta go now...

1. From your previous post your point seems to be that: "Well, Allah doesn't guide you, you do it yourself. If Allah did, you wouldn't commit such sins. Allah revealed the Holy Quran for you to help and guide yourself."

My point is that Allah is All Powerful, All Hearing, All Seeing and All Knowing and that He has control over everything. He guides whom he wills (Surah 2, ayat 272). That is why we ask Allah for guidance at least 17 times a day when we recite Surah al-Fatiah during our prayers (Surah 1, ayat 6). Yes, we have the capability to read, learn and think. But Allah is the one who has given us these capabilities. It is through His will that things happen, not our own. "His command is only when He intends a thing that He says to it , 'Be," and it is (Surah 36, ayat 82)." He has given us the right to make the choices, but it is only Allah who determines what happens to us afterwards. We have control over our choices, but not over the outcomes.

Surah 2, ayat 255:
"Allah- there is no deity except Him, the Ever-Living, the Sustainer of [all] existence. Neither drowsiness overtakes Him nor sleep. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. Who is it that can intecede with Him except by His permission? He knows what is [presently] before tham and what will be after them, and they encompass not a thing of His knowledge except for what He wills. His Kursi extends over the heavens and the earth, and their perservation tires Him not. Ane He is the Most High, the Most Great."

2. Thanks for recommending that book, but inshAllah I need to finish the Quran first. I encourage everyone, including myself, to read the entire Quran in a language that they understand.

3. Yes Allah has given us the brain to think, but that does not mean we can guide ourselves. We are giving ourselves to much credit if we think that. We have to try to learn, try to think, try to make the right choices. But without Allah's help, guidance, and permission, we can not do any of these things.

[uvaskaves]

Brother BD-Shardul, do not be frustrated, try to be patient. If someone calls me a fanatic for adhering to the Quran and Sunnah, I take it as a compliment. After all, remember what the Prophet (PBUH) said: ""I leave behind me two things, the Quran and my example, the Sunnah, and if you follow these you will never go astray."

Some of the so called "intelligent and independent beings" seem to forget that Allah did not create mankind except to worship Him alone. They seem to forget that this life is temporary, while the Herefater is forever.

[BANFAN]

Originally Posted by BD-Shardul
And when I was in high school, once our religion education teacher said to a boy after observing his prayer, "আচ্ছা, তুমি কী নামাজের সুরা-কেরাত আগেই পড়ে রাখ? মসজিদে এসে কী খালি প্রাকটিস দাও নাকি?"। আজকে আমরা মুসলমানেরা যে নামায পড়ি, তা শুধু প্রাকটিস। দুঃখজনক, কিন্তু সত্যি।

True. Saying prayer like a sparrow isn't 'Salat' at all.

[BANFAN]

Originally Posted by PoorFan
Question 1 : When we talk about authenticity of 'Shahi Bukhari' are we talking about those hadith ( 2600+ ) that Imam Bukhari himself believed to be Shahi ( authentic )? or his entire hadith book, which contains more than 7000 hadith? Same question goes with hadith 'Shahi Muslim', as it said that Imam Muslim has extracted 4000 hadith out of 300,000, whereas hadith Muslim book contains more than 9000 of hadith.

So once again my question is, when we talking on 'Shai hadith', are we talking about each and every hadith of those Six book? or only those that Imam Bukhari, Imam Islam has ( was able to ) recognized as authentic?

Question 2 : Is there any way to know exactly which are those hadith that Imam Bukhari and Imam Islam ( was able to ) recognized as authentic?

Those who have knowledge please share.

Scientifically, is it possible to certify for a person after 200+ years, as to which of the hearsays are right and which are wrong?

Follow the Quran man, don't need to follow hearsays. Quran has enough details and examples to understand all by itself. None can write in more clear words than Allah. Give that a try, there is no confusions.

[Banglatiger84]

To rephrase Kabir Bhai's idea more succintly let me ask everyone the following,

Are the following 2 people equal in eyes of Islam: One who prays and is nice to people, and one who prays but lies and is rude to people of other races ?

[BANFAN]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
To rephrase Kabir Bhai's idea more succintly let me ask everyone the following,

Are the following 2 people equal in eyes of Islam: One who prays and is nice to people, and one who prays but lies and is rude to people of other races ?

Never Ever.

I doubt if you can call the second cat 'Muslim'

[Kabir]

By nature, I don't try to make a topic "tita"...unless I have to prove myself innocent.

In this case, I would certainly not try and make it tita...so I would say, we should agree to disagree. Some of the folks here got the point I made, and some didn't. For those who didn't, the most difficult thing for them seem to be the ability to give "human brain" some credits for its decision-making abilities.

The myth is, and will be...as long as we don't understand use our brain.

Carry on, and don't respond to this post of mine. I have little time for people who don't try to see the big picture.